Why is VF best?

Discussion in 'Junky's Jungle' started by akiralove, Jan 18, 2006.

  1. akiralove

    akiralove Well-Known Member

    XBL:
    JTGC
    It's no secret that VF players (and some non VF players as well) love to tout VF as the best fighting game.

    Having been playing some DOA4 recently, I've once again come to this conclusion pretty quickly. I never really expected that game to replace VF in my heart, but I didn't expect to become bored so quickly, with thoughts of VF on my mind usually when I play.

    I'm interested in hearing WHY people ENJOY VF more than other fighting games. I know it's "the deepest", and most of us know the ways in which it's system runs deeper than other 3-D games, that's been discussed endlessly. It has to be something more than that. I mean, games like "Civilization" are deep, but I'm not really interested in them.

    I propose that it isn't the depth in itself that makes the game fun, it's something in the way that we interact with our chosen characters, and how those characters interact with other people's characters that makes the game fun.

    Looking back in time at earlier versions of the game, they didn't have as many systems (VF3 being a kind of exception, because it had unique systems which are now gone), so one could say they weren't "as deep" as VF4, or that even FT is "deeper" than Version C. Yet for most of us, VF has always remained head and shoulders above other games, even when it was a simpler game. For me, the first time I SAW people playing VF2, I knew it was the best fighting game ever, before I even played it. I think this decision though was just as emotional as it was analytical. I think there was something about VF's world that sucked me in, for lack of a better way to put it.

    So, discuss

    Bryan
     
  2. SlimTYME

    SlimTYME Well-Known Member

    Great topic.

    I personally started playing VF back in VF2, although started playing 'properly' when VF3 came out and bought VF2 for the Saturn to practice the basic tools of the VF system.

    I don't know how relevant my opinion is, as I'm just an 'average' player in comparison to some players on this site though. But I guess I just love the way you can play the game (and be sucessful) both defensively and offensively (obviously or a mixture of both LOL). I think this is what makes the different styles of players apparent in players today (and why I love VF more than any other fighter). There is a set 'system' in VF, this is true, but it's so varied and can be adapted to a players personal style of play to such a degree and can be so fun learning the system, combined with players personal character styles to combine into a seperate player style. With VF 5 just around the corner and the future system changes that are going to happen, we are as players going to have to readapt, but this is part of the fun. I for one am going to have a lot of fun, not to mention finally having a 'card' for VF, although the superflous nature of items pales into insignificance for me personally next to the getting character ranks, but will be great fun nonetheless.

    Bottom line, I hope we all enjoy ourselves, it's gonna be a bumpy ride. Care to join me?

    (Whoah, I can waffle LOL).
     
  3. Plague

    Plague Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    plague-cwa
    XBL:
    HowBoutSmPLAGUE
    I like that the fighting is vicious without having gratuitous violence. I started playing with Jacky in VF2 - the thwok of the beatknuckle followed by the smashing crash of a flip kick sounded so awesome. The finality of a jumping pounce - so brutal. Months later I saw someone perform some reversals with VF2 Akira - wish I knew who that guy was - I was just floored "that was so fucking cool I can't believe it!" No fireballs or twenty hit combos needed.

    Now I like the reward for doing something risky - the super-high float from a rising attack broken with Akira's knee - the crumpling /versus/images/commands/f.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif follow-up to a successful /versus/images/commands/b.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/k.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif sabaki. Brian does a side-step Dragon Cannon on me and then hits with an Akira specific, stance-specific combo - brilliant. This leads right into how much I appreciate the community of players I have around me. Thursday nights at AI resound with exclamations from everyone watching when I pull off something big. I feel like I'm a star for those few frames and I cheer in turn for everyone else. Also, I can't begin to say how much it means that people come all the way to my house to play. I'm always so honored.

    I see the VFDC community play roles larger than just game players. Some of you appear in the freakin' Orange Book in that little photo inside the cover - it wouldn't have happened if people didn't go the extra mile to really dedicate their efforts. The Evo2K3 after-party at Sean's place - OMFG, best VF party ever. E3 tournaments at Bryan's place - just fucking unreal. Things get bigger. People like Heidi and Ali interview creators. Shit, Bryan is credited in a PS2 VF instruction manual for translation.

    VF = great game + great community = best!
     
  4. Shadowdean

    Shadowdean Well-Known Member

    Plague brought up the issue of sounds...which was always so important to me. VF had some of the most visceral sounding crunches in any fighting game. I really felt like I was doing some damage when I heard the sounds.
    In VF, I feel like I can get into more of a "zone" than any other fighting game. This feeling of detachment from the rest of the world rarely comes to me, usually only when I am at martial arts or skiing. This is a very personal thing, but I can get lost inside of VF, especially with good human competition.
    Fighting, as anybody who has/does fight will tell you; is not a mathematical formula, but there are usually the "correct" options and the "gutsy" option. While VF definatly lends itself more to textbook play, there is enough give that if you do something that may not be frame-data correct, it can still reap huge rewards both on the health bar and inside of the opponents head. If you just do rediculous crap all day, you will get murdered, but a well timed, unexpected move can really change the course of the battle. No fighting game is balanced, some characters in VF definatly just have advantages over other characters, but no character is at such a disadvantage that it is almost hopeless to play with them.
    The community, aside from a few people who make it a point to be astringent or just arrogant, the VF community is really a group of great people who generally have lives outside of this game. The NYC people have on multiple occasions welcomed me into their homes, given me a place to crash, but more importantly given me a great set of "true friends." Andy and Adam in particular I need to give my thanks for really opening up their places to me. Recently, the Cali Crew gave me a warm welcominng (well, a year ago or so) and that was another great experince. All the people that dragged themselves to play with me - Matt, Smurfy, Jun (fun while it lasted..get at me bro, let me know how Singapore is treating you!!), Ice-9 (remember when you and shota murdered me when vf3 came out...got so bad we had to get a hotel in college park to play!), etc etc...great memories that are more than the sum of the game that is VF.
     
  5. GreatDeceiver

    GreatDeceiver Well-Known Member

    The very basic concept of risk/reward is executed almost flawlessly in VF, compared to other fighting games. I think it's really the greatest reason why I love VF so much.

    Also, all characters have such a great amount of thought put into them, how they're implemented; everything comes around very well, because the global system itself is very, very solid.

    There are no gratuitous concessions in VF - or almost none. It's a very precise game that makes me feel like I'm in total control of the character I'm using, instead of running through hoops to get exactly what I want.

    In all respects, it's extremely elegant, devoid of unnecessary excesses and empty fillers, and - this is very important - the system progresses significantly with each iteration.

    The learning curve for VF, for me, has been truly remarkable - after all the technicalities, I have a feeling that things come around full-circle, and the very basic, first concepts remain very, very important even after everything that I've learned.
     
  6. Blondie

    Blondie Well-Known Member

    I've played many fighting games, 2D and 3D. Coming to a realization that 3D was my favorite i quickly picked up tekken and tekken tag as my favorite due to competition readily being available. My world changed when Ghostdog travelled down for some virtuafighter and started something in central florida. Once I became aware of the depth of virtuafighter and it "not" being just all about spacing and safe moves, i was sold. The risk/reward system of VF is like no other. If you were to look at the moves in VF from a moves list, all the moves seem completely balanced. There is always a way out of "most" situations. I think the fact that we all like competition and the mind games that are connected to vf, it keeps us coming back for more.

    The reality of vf and it's balance are why i think it is the best fighter on the planet. Nothing completely flashy or fictional.
     
  7. Isoulle

    Isoulle Member

    I'd honestly have to say the depth. I know, it's the typical answer but it's also the truth. I love my games to be complicated (Up to a point). Something which VF more then qualifies as. It takes so much skill and yomi to play that it is exceedingly enjoyable in my mind. But not only is it complex, but it also flows and moves smoothly. It plays quickly and doesn't get weighed down with its own complexity. It's a near perfect melding of substance and execution as when you play it, you have to think and strategize while avoiding the tedious repition and pointless excess of most deep games.

    It's honeslty the only 3D fighter that's ever caught my interest and held it. (I'm honestly, in general, more of a 2D then 3D fan. I never found SC, Tekken, or especially DOA as deep as a good 2D fighter. However VF not only meets the standard set by good 2D fighters, it surpasses it.)

    There's also how well balanced it is, the customization system is cool, and graphics are nice. But honestly when it comes down to it, the game is just really deep and plays exceptionally well.
     
  8. Genzen

    Genzen Well-Known Member

    You want to know why VF is the best?

    Jeffry's special win poses.....
     
  9. Darrius_Cole

    Darrius_Cole Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    Darrius-Cole
    XBL:
    Darrius Cole HD
    Once upon a time I said that from a certain point of view fighting games are like women. Since that time, 2 more Ms. Right-Now's have come and gone (Tekken 5, SC3). Now a third has come, and with the opening of this thread, has begun to pass, earlier than expected I might add. And here we are, still happy with the same Mrs. Right.

    The addage still hold true, "If fighting games were women, VF would be the one you marry."

    All of the above points are correct and add to the overall quality of the experience. Of those I think the risk/reward system and the variety of options make the biggest difference. Because together they add up to what I think is the lowest common denominator that differentiates VF from all other games.

    That denominator is freedom.

    When I play other 3-D games eventually all the options and flaws become obvious and the players get scared to make a move. Normally these games start to reward turtling, and at high levels the game slows down. As most of your options start to offer too much punishment for failure compared to the reward for success and the probability of success, the game takes most of your options from you. You are not really free to make choices.

    VF is the complete opposite. In VF, I am afraid of not moving. VF punishes turtling. At high levels the game speeds up as you have to input more commands in smaller windows, all the while you have no shortage of viable options. The game itself doesn't restrain your creativity. You are free to make whatever decision you wish, without ever being pushed into a corner with only one way to go.

    Where is the evidence of this freedom: There are several ways to play every character. Because the game allows players their choice of several options at every point in the game, different people consistently make different choices. The casual observer can see it in the different styles that are used to play each character.
     
  10. vanity

    vanity Well-Known Member

    As stated, because the game perfectly uses the risk/reward scenario, but more importantly:

    Because the game makes sense.

    I don't know how to explain it, but when I play it, it just feels natural, everything about it. Every time I press a button I know why I'm pressing it, and I don't throw things out at random, ever.

    And best of all, when I lose, I know why I lose. I can always trace everything to a point where either I made a mistake, or where my opponent made a lucky guess (they all are /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif).

    Not to mention, the speed. So many people complain when they first play the game about how slow it feels. But really, it's just so fast paced, and this leads to more matches. And more matches with quicker rounds leads to really tense competition, especially when hitting 3 or 4 moves will win you the round.
     
  11. tianyuan2k2

    tianyuan2k2 Well-Known Member

    1) balance
    2) competition

    1) may not has to be deep, shallow could be balanced too. Not matter how deep a game is, it's matter of time for u to learn, to practice, to build up the reflex etc. actually it sound boring, but i have fun during the process. It's just the personal taste.

    2) if every other vf players are button mashers, i will not play vf, period. i want competition not bullying kids. Enjoy the competition is another personal taste.

    Why is VF best?

    I will answer that later, maybe?
     
  12. RandomHajile2

    RandomHajile2 Well-Known Member

    its the best because its the 1st basicly

    you could go one about how it was a simple 3 button system, but the games has thousands of moves!

    but also i would hav to say in vf a button mashin scrub could never beat you, unlike tekken an soul calibur!!!

    the "spacing" you can do in vf is better then any game, an if anything other games try to copy it.

    anyways its a bit of a silly question

    if you dont know, you'll never know
     
  13. akiralove

    akiralove Well-Known Member

    XBL:
    JTGC
    a lot of good answers

    Random Hajile: this wasn't a question asked because I didn't know for myself why VF is the best game, to me. I wanted to hear what other people would say, if asked to explain. In that regard, I don't think it's silly, and people have come out with interesting answers.

    So, keep 'em coming /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    Bryan
     
  14. MADrox

    MADrox Well-Known Member

    Plague has some great similar points as mine; but i'll expand with my opinion.

    I started playing during VF1(not knowing what I was doing) and enjoyed playing the game for some odd reason- think it was its unique look and feel. it wasnt until VF3 that i became interested / knew about a VF scene (especially in japan) - since then I was hooked, and the people here is what makes me continue to enjoy it.

    gameplay - I loved how there was a unique way of playing for every person. I played my character one way, and everyone else played it another ; all of us relying heavily on our own specific techniques and each time we play they end we continually try to out yomi eachother. This guessing / knowledge game makes VF a continuous challenge . this challenge that continuously builds is what i like about it (unfortuantely i dont learn very well /versus/images/graemlins/shocked.gif)

    look - there is something unique in VF. its serious , yet goofy (with poses). Its moves are subtle/simple with some added flair when needed be. It just a very mature feeling when I watch and play any of the VF's.

    people - what has really made me a fan of VF and continues to this day , is the people in our community. I can honestly say I have not met one person that annoyed or bothered me that was into VF compared to other communities. I feel a lot of people in this scene are very appreciative of a game rather than being comparative .like when you continually hear other gamers watch vf and just complain/critique; instead of just saying those are pretty cool moves.
    Reminds of the Mortal Kombat 2/3 / Street fighter 2+ days; you could not go to an arcade with out a fight happening , even during testing.. those were fun violent times where you'd have to prove your skills on and off the screen. No way this happens in any gathering / tourney i've been to for VF.
    So far i've met toronto, Minneapolis, omaha, orlando, NY, NJ crew through out my history in VF. All are class acts and never had a bad time. I continue to learn and appreciate VF with everyone here mainly because of the competitive entusiasm we share with this game.

    in short - VF offers a very unique experience that other games didnt and could not offer me states side.

    love-stino
     
  15. Dan

    Dan Well-Known Member

    I've never met a VF player (like real vf player) in my life so I don't know about the community but I can say what makes this game pretty freaking dope from my own point of view.

    The game honestly feels like fighting chess, and that's pretty damn cool. It's really everything a fighting game should be. You have a basic understandable system that branches out into great depth.

    What I love the most is the generally there is an answer to everything and it's built into the system perfectly. Out of that you have many more options that all have different advantages and of course counter balancing weaknesses.

    Everything besides jumping (well for me) has a use and works when used that way. The company caters to it's dedicated fans as far as gameplay is concerned.

    Most of all when you work hard to figure out the game you get solid rewards. I remember first time I played VF4 with some budds I was falling for trashy tactics but I put some serious time in training modes and read up to learn the game. Next time I wiped the floor with them, that's how a fighting game should be.

    Honestly I still like my favorite series Dead or Alive more but I have no doubts in my mind why VF is so damn respected and SO DAMN FUN.
     
  16. Old_V3

    Old_V3 Member

    actually I just started really getting into Virtua Fighter not too long ago, but I can see why it is the best fighting game out there, it's like every move has to be planned out before it happens, cause almost everything can be stopped or countered unless you pull it in a certain way.

    For example: guaranteed throw moves shouldn't be thrown out unless they are "guaranteed" to hit, pun intended, other wise you'll get thrown.

    That why I like it and also it's a big community to help you get better, most fighting games don't have that
     
  17. Steptoe_Akira

    Steptoe_Akira Well-Known Member

    Don't be silly, tekken tag is the best, wavedash, EWGF, hellsweep, 112 is all that matter in life nothing else.
     
  18. Crazy_Galaxy

    Crazy_Galaxy Well-Known Member

    Lies it's only cause YOU can't step as well in vf /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  19. Devilman

    Devilman Member

    Hi /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I'm new here, a poor lonesome french VF fan lol

    Why VF if the best for me ?

    - each fighter is multi-dimensionnal, you can play them in many different ways, offensive, aggressive, defensive, as a striker, as a grappler etc... I've never seen that in any other fighting games, in Tekken for example, each character is the prisonner of his "stereotype", you only have one way to fight with each character ;

    - the martial styles are much more realistic than in any other game, compare Jacky's Jeet Kune Do with Law's parody of "Bruce Lee's movies style" in Tekken, or Brad's Kickboxing with Bryan Fury's "Jean-Caude Van Damme" style lol, I think AM² guys spent much time studying the styles of their fighters, while Namco just made their fighters based upon what we can see in action movies ;

    - fights in VF are in "real time", I don't know how to explain that feeling, I feel it only with VF and DOA, those two series are responsive, things happen just when you think them, there's no delay, and you can use your reflexes, for example, in VF, you can avoid and counter a sweeper by jumping with a flying kick, in real time, in Tekken, if a player makes a sweeper, your only option is to defend, or use a counter, if you try to jump over it, you'll get hit anyway, in Tekken (and Soulcalibur) when your opponent starts to strike, you can only defend or counter if your character has counters, in VF, if a player strikes up, you can just crouch and strike down, in real time, while in Tekken, when your opponents starts to strike, you'll have to wait or counter, the first to make a move seems to have the priority ;

    - the depth, until I got my copy of VF4 Evo few monthes ago, I still was discovering some tips on VF3 for DC... no games have such depth and a great lurning curve than a VF, in fact, VF is the opposite of Tekken or SC, Tekken and SC look great, with their characters full of personnality and violence, everything is spectacular, but, then, when you start to play them, they'll soon show their limits, and in few weeks, you have seen all which have to been seen in those game, VF may not look as cool and spectacular, but you need monthes just to understand and master the basics of the game, and then, monthes if you want to really master a character, and then, you have years of fun, especially if you have a human opponent... and VF is the only fighting game that you can enjoy for years in solo, I don't know anybody who plays Tekken or SC solo after 3 monthes lol

    - fights are intense, it may last 10 secondes, but in those 10 secondes, a thousand of things happen, VF is the only 3D fighting game I know which has the "psychological" aspect of a real fight, fighting in VF is not just with the button, but with your mind, there's a real interaction between the players, you can make the other react using fake moves, you can make him affraid by punishing him at each mistake he makes, everything is intense and in real time, for this point, VF is the only 3D fighter which rivalises with 2D games such as the Street Fighter series...

    I think there are many other reasons why VF is my favorite, but I think I've told enough for now lol

    My top 5 3D fighting games are :

    1°) VF

    2°) DOA

    3°) "not great games but I still like them" like UFC/Pride, Bushido Blade/Kengo, Fire Pro Wrestling D

    4°) SC

    5°) Tekken

    That's all /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     
  20. THE_WALL

    THE_WALL Well-Known Member

    I went to the devolucion party/tournament event it rocked. Seeing the skill that VF players have and the amount of practice they have put in is truly amazing. After the event I wen't home and practiced. I started to work on combos and eventually started to learn buffer tricks like b-f p then b-ff p&k. That's what makes virtua fighter the best out there is that it strives to make you a better player by improving your game though combos and buffer moves. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif
    My favorite story with the game is with Shun-Di playing VF4 EVO. I was in the arcade and I was using Shun-Di I got all the way to Dural and at the end of the fifth or third match I got a draw, after that I went on to Sudden Death, it was there that I was able to beat Dural with the low rolling punch ( the one that goes into a sweep). With only one shot at Dural I felt like the luckiest man alive for landing the move. It's stories like that that make Virtua Fighter the best fighting game out there! /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     

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