Would Post Fight Statistics Improve Fight Quality?

Does anyone remember the player stats analysis that were in VF4? or the less useful ones in VF4 Evo?
Although they weren't perfect, Sega was on the right track. IMO if we had post match stats available after every fight, I think over time the quality of most players matches would naturally improve. Just looking at the Win/Loss stat isn't enough. Sure Replays help to analyze what you're doing vs what you're opponent is doing. But sometimes its simply not clear in the replay, not in the way that stats can make things clear.

I would like to see Sega add to the Virtua Fighter series the same kind of post fight analysis that games like UFC or Boxing has.

Of course these kind of stats don't necessarily always lead to a higher quality fight. But it does allow both players to see a little more than win vs loss. When you see these stats you have the opportunity to see how you won or loss in more concrete terms. Its been my experience that access to these kinds of stats do lead to higher quality fights (for players who pay attention)

Post Fight Quality Stats VF could be:

#Throws attempted, Throws successful
# of low attacks attempted / successful
# of high attacks attempted /successful
# of side attacks attempted /successful
#2 hit combos
#3 hit combos
#4 hit combos
#5 hit combos
# Attacks Successfully Evaded
# Attacks Successfully Blocked
# OM Successful
# DM Successful
Avergage Duration of Rounds
# Advantage situations
# Disadvantage situations
# Advantage situations taken
# Advantage situations dropped
# of wall Attacks attempted/successful
# of wall Attack opportunities Missed
# of Ring outs
# Average Remaining Health Bar
# Of Low Attacks Received
# Mid/High Attacks Received
# Times Thrown
# Inahsis successful
# sabaki's successful

Some Carrer total Stats could be:

Average # Attempted/Successful Low Attacks per match
Average # Attempted/Successful High Attacks per match
Average # Attempted/Successful Throws per match
Average # Successful Throw escapes per match
Average # Successful Evades per match
Average length Combo perfomed per match
Total Dojo Time (in actual hours/minutes)
Player's Class (A,B,C,etc)
Player's Win/ Los Ratio

A post fight analysis would give both players a way to really see what their opponent hit them with. Sometimes if a fighter is far beyond your skill set and you lose, but can't really put your finger on why, a post fight statistics would give you objective analysis of what just went on. You could see, what your opponent did right, and what you did wrong. Also Stats are great when helping you fine tune your game. Sometimes you just barely lose, but don't know what to do to close the deal, stats can't help you finish matches more successfully.

The stats could be saved right along with the replays. In the UFC games you have the option to view stats or not.

Would Post Fight Stats be a good thing for VF? Or are they in the same category as Cutscenes, Storylines, unnecessary for the VF community?

 

This would be cool, especially if it could keep track of an entire player match session etc.

 

For the most part, no, I wouldn't find these stats helpful. A lot of these categories are making assumptions, like that every attack should hit, and some things can't be categorized so easily, like advantage "dropped" could be someone staggering their attacks against a higher level player to create CH situations. Some things are super extraneous, like number of #-hit combos, and combo time length.

The only things I'd really like to see would be throw break percentage, average round duration, total dojo time, total online time, total offline time and total system time. Everything else is either too extraneous or completely useless for me.

 

I dunno, the average number of 2 hit, 3hit, 5hit combos per round/ per fight I could certainly use. sometimes I think the fight went one way, and then I look at the replay and realized it was quite as I remembered it. I would like to know the average no. of times I'm thrown during a fight. (Should I work I my throw escape more or not?) Sure I can remember what happened in some of my more anticipated matches, but thats about it. I might play 20-30 matches a day (I'm not going to be able to keep a mental record of each fight) Also I don't want to go back through the replays of each fight just to get the statistics.

Average rounds lost by ring out hmmm. could be good,

You guys do realize that other serious fighting games keep these detail of statistics, for instance UFC undisputed 3, or Fighting night Champion.....

 

UFC and FNC are not serious fighters. Fight Night is a boxing sim, it's not even close to relevant.

The number of times you are thrown is not as clear or as useful as what your throw break percentage is.

Why does it matter how many hits your combo was? The question you should be asking is am I doing max damage? Hits don't matter, damage does. For example: do all the long combos with Eileen you want, Wolf can still outdamage her in half that number.

There's a reason no one else responded to this thread. Think about that.

 

Yeah it's called master po

 

@R_PANDA, the fact of the matter is, no matter what kind of martial arts/fighting or athletic activity of any kind (simulated or real) you might engage in, the more statistics you have measuring your performance, the more opportunities you have to improve that performance from an empirical point of view. The more indicators you have, the more information you have, the more base cases you have. That's trainer 101 stuff.


And as far as your statement:


"There's a reason no one else responded to this thread. Think about that".


You responded, what does that say about you? What's worse, your response was poorly thought out, if it was thought out at all, pretty much of the troll variety.


You are of course categorically wrong in both of the premises of your post:


1) If you're comparing seriousness or the realness of fighting within the video games Virtua Fighter, UFC Undisputed, and Fight Night Boxing, obviously VF loses for any number of reasons for example VF contains 'Floating, infinite stamina, ability to come back from broken necks, broken spines (flying in the case of Kage) , shattered legs, crushed thoraxes etc all without blood, bruises.


2) The first thing any martial artist, fighter, or any other athlete needs to improve, is a detailed assessment of their past performances. That's what stats are young man (detailed assessments of past performances) You use the stats to see if they can reveal strengths and weaknesses. Some times it takes skills to look at a set of stats and translate it into a action plan (maybe that's where you lack experience) But all of the stats that I listed can be used to improve you VF game. Would you like me to explain them one by one?


Just so were clear my friend.


You can be serious about VF, but VF is not necessarily serious about fighting.

VF takes hand to hand combat more serious than some of its competitors, e.g Tekken, DOA, etc. But it is sstill based on an alternate reality where the fighting styles in the game could be real, but are in fact not real.


On the other hand, the Steven Segal kick in UFC is based in reality because real fighters have used, and do use it in real martial arts moves. The superman punch is based on reality, chuck lidell and others have used and do use it. And these fights are serious and the Fights that occur in the UFC and FNC video games are designed to depict the "seriousness" of the martial arts fights that they simulate.



R_panda, R_panda, R_panda, tsk, tsk, tsk.

 

Just so you know masterpo Tekken Federation website is tracking the kind of stuff you're asking Virtua Fighter to do. It is something that's totally doable. I'm actually very impressed with the way they're handling the online website integration with the gameplay. It's like social media and fighting games fused into one.

 

Yeah that would sound great so when players see their statistics after the fight they know what they can really work on to improve their game.

 

@tricky that's good news I'll check it out!

Yea, I presented this thread as a rhetorical question, but of course the availability of statistics help in virtually any situation you are trying to improve, fighting games and VF in particular are no exception. Anyone that is disagreeing with me on this , is simply doing so because its me that is making the assertion LOL. Don't Hate! Congratulate

When I look at the sheer number and category of statistics that are kept by UFC"s undisputed 3, I'm just amazed. And of course these statistics are extremely useful.

Granted, not everyone will use the same statistics, or even use the statistics in the same ways, but in my experience, if there is a statistic given, someone will find a good use for it.

For some reason VF5FS is going backward on this. VF5FS is a fighting game that no longer keeps win/loss statistics OMG! sure it does in ranked mode, but that's it! Its like a racing game that doesn't keep track of who won the race LOL. I initially thought that it was just the fact the game was so cheap that maybe they couldn't afford to put even the bare minimum of statistics in, but when I look at the progression of VF from VF4 to VF5FS with each version they taken out more and more statistics from the game, to the point now that in single player not only do you not have win/loss statistics, but because of missing ring names we now don't even know who we don't have win loss statistics for unless you are playing in ranked mode you have very little statistical tracking if any in VF. Who wants to play a fighting game that doesn't in some way track wins/loses, or games played, opponents met, something....

If VF is supposed to be one of if not the best fighting games out there (and I believe it to be) then it should have one of if not the best set of post fight statistics available in a fighting game. And currently UFC and FNC own this space.

We can be such hypocrites on VFDC, on the one hand so many of us claim to be fighting purists and on the other hand we reject what any real fighting purist would obviously see as valuable

 

I don't think it'd make too much of a difference because a lot of the time you have to use different tactics when playing different people. On top of all the options you have.

Like maybe ones throw % could be low simply cause their opponent/opponents likes to use abare for defense. So that necessarily doesn't mean you should try for throws more, just that the option to throw vs certain opponents/the people one has been playing aren't as effective.

 

C'mon FeauchA maaan....

The career stats would be cumulative over many many games so what happened during one or two matches would not be the overall indicator. Trends like the majority of the time you are at dis advantage or 90% time your throw attempts fail, or 3hit combos represent your average length of combo during a match are simple example of how valuable stats would be.

And even if you want to talk about the immediate post game stats, it would definitely give you a window into how you are doing against a particular opponent and what that opponent is able to successfully do to you.

C'mon guys this is an easy one.

In every sport I can think of serious statistics are kept and used for all kinds of analysis, in many cases to improve athlete, coach, team, etc performance. In every kind of competition that I can think of from scrabble competitions to chess matches statistics are kept and used to improve performance. How can you cats not understand that VF players would also benefit greatly from more/better/deeper statistics being kept,.

Starting with win/loss ratios in 2 player LOL!

You dudes need to stop making excuses for SEGA and VF. Yes VF has one of the greatest fighting engines of all time. But it falls far behind other arcade fighters/simulation fighters in almost every other respect.

And the fact that VF has almost a total lack of any kind of post fight statistic is a unnecessary black mark against a already struggling title, even if it has a superior fight game engine. These days having a superior fighting game engine is necessary but not sufficient.

Also I feel sorry for any player that cannot improve his or her game if given additional information about their game play. You cats that are posting statistics wouldn't help you, are saying, that no amount of new information would improve your game play. That means that either you are VF gods or really fucked up

 

I remember those stats in VF4 and Evo. Loved them. Though not perfect, just looking through allowed me to see what my tendencies were.

I'd love to have

# Attacks out of disadvantage
# Counter hits received/landed

 

Those VF4 EVO stats were pretty good for making a more focused lab time. Can't say I miss them much these days, as watching replays tends to do the job for me.